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A red flag on Teixeira?
October 9th, 2008, 6:30 am · 21 Comments · posted by Ellen Bell, Afternoon Angel
Mark Teixeira, the soon to be free agent, is a perfect fit for a lot of teams including the New York Yankees, who will have a lot of money to throw around this winter with some hefty contracts coming off the books.
But in exploring the fit between the Yankees and Teixeira, there were some words of caution offered by a former teammate through the New York Post.
“The statistics will be there, but this is not a player who will make anyone else on the team better,” said a former teammate of Teixeira’s. “The numbers indicate an elite player, but if you watch him every day you will realize he is a very good player, not elite.”
Do you buy that?
There was a lot of chatter that Teixeira and his solid approach to the game and particularly at the plate would rub off on the likes of Vladimir Guerrero, Howie Kendrick and Erick Aybar, which is ridiculous. Guerrero was given a huge contract doing things his way, so what incentive does he have to change at this point in his career? To think he would become a more patient hitter with Teixeira around is just naive.
That is on Guerrero, Kenrdick and Aybar, though, not Teixeira.
But it is an interesting question, one which the Angels will have to try to answer, particularly if they are planning to bring back much of their 2008 roster next season.
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Teixeira is only 28 yrs old and continues to get better and better. Sign him and let go of Garland, Anderson and Rodriquez. He is someone you can build around. Obviously Guerrero and Anderson have not made anyone better as well.
I don’t think it’s being naive to hope some of Tex rubs off on Vladdy. Vlad did appear to take more pitches once Tex showed up. Look at the 8th inning of game 4. Vlad had an 0-2 count and drew a walk. When has that ever happened??? I think it’s naive for a sports writer who’s around the game everyday to NOT assume the clubhouse isn’t affected by a professional hitter being added to the team 3 months before playoffs. Tex was simply amazing for us and I hope he really thinks hard about the Halos and Arte gives him what he’s asking for. With Anderson most likely gone and Vlad on the decline we need Tex more than ever.
Does it just so happen that when Frankie has a record year it also is the year his contract expires? Don’t give him a huge contract because he won’t work hard till he is up for free agency again.
Anderson is still a solid RBI hitter, In wouldn’t lose him. Frankie’s gotta go, record or not! Arrendondo can more than fill that void! even thougth the post season seems to be a concern for him, Vlad’s still a great asset, don’t lose him.
The only reason the Angels need Teix is that they need to have two first basemen. Morales could be our starting first basemen but who would fill in if he got hurt. If only we still had Kotchman. Might be better to save the money and shop for Morales backup.
Everyone’s definition of “elite” is different. He had similar numbers to A-Rod this year and essentially a gold-glove. A-Rod is known to be a complete nightmare in the locker room - just ask Jeter - so why is he “elite” but Teixeira is not? I heard about him being focused on the business side of baseball but guess what, that’s what it is! He’s NOT a guy that will bat .350 like he did the last two months of the season but he’s been a solid .290 hitter with good power from both sides of the plate and a gold glove. If he’s not elite, he’s damn close!
Does he make others better? He made Vladdy a better hitter because he got BETTER pitches to hit. Check his average - it went up over 30 points after Teixeira arrived and was placed in front of him in the lineup. Prior to that, he HAD to swing at stuff in the dirt. Guys feed off a guy that gets big hits and CLUTCH hits. He’s a run-producer and someone we need in that lineup.
Say goodbye to Anderson and replace him with a more affordable Rivera. Say goodbye to K-Rod, who was one single away from having 32 saves instead of 62 saves. Hitters get BETTER in the post-season and he simply won’t save many games in October because he’s too wild. Further, if you gave Scot Shields 69 opportunities, I’m fairly certain he’d get at least 55 - 60 saves as well. No thanks to spending $15m to get 3 outs.
I was more impressed with Teixeira everytime I saw him play. Great hitter and a awesome glove. Pay this guy! He did more in the playoffs than anyone else too.
I hope that one thing Tex. keeps in mind as he talks to clubs is who will give to him the best chance of returning to the playoffs. In my opinion, he will get the money that he is looking for from most of the teams that he talks to. But, as every est coast bias fan likes to remind everyone, the Angels are in an easy division compared to the AL East. Well, maybe that is so, but it gives the Angels a better chance every year with making the playoffs. The Yankees will no doubt throw a ton of money his way, but what you’ve seen this year with them (not making the playoffs) may very well be a pattern to come. Not only do they have to content with Boston, but now a young and hungry Rays team just to make the playoffs. As a die hard Angels fan, I am crushed with what happened this year. But if you think about the Angels-Soxs series, every game was a great game. Tex. finally has a taste of the playoffs and , although we lost, it was a pretty good taste. Of the teams mentioned that will be going after Tex, the Angles have the best shot of returning to the playoffs.
Tex is a solid player! He is great with the glove and great with the bat. he is not a homerun or nothing type hitter. He is just as happy to take a walk as he is to drive the ball. Vlad can learn a lot from Tex. If Vlad would learn to be more patient at the plate and wait for his pitch his numbers would soar again. I think Vlad is hurt and not saying much about it, you are not that great for that many years and then have this kind of season without a reason.
DUMP K ROD, GARLAND and thank GA but let him go. Save the money for TEX!
Frankie had a record year because they played close games, and he had the chances. You put Nathan, Papelbon, and Rivera in 69 save opportunities, they’re going to get 60+ saves to.
Compare the stats of Frankie, Nathan, Papelbon, Rivera, and even Lidge. Frankie is 5th in the group on quite a few numbers like walks allowed, e.r.a, whip, etc.
Frankie isn’t worth the money.
In my experience, most “former teammates” talk about players like Tex in that manner because they are: A. not as good. B. Jealous, and C. idiots
This post is completely asinine. It’s Teixeira’s fault for “not making the guys around him better?” This guy is one of the best players in the league. All old baseball beat writers resort to this character/determination nonsense when they have nothing else to say. If the Angels had somehow won the World Series this year, Teixiera would’ve been viewed as a “winner” and someone who “willed his team over the top.” Give me a break; this whole blog entry is a complete crock and a bunch of mularkey. How about the other guys around Teixeira take responsibility for their play and perform better?
Hey guys, I found this blog entry from deadspin and thought I’d share a bit of my perspective having watched Teixeira over parts of the last two seasons.
Before I start my long-winded post, I want to point out that when the Braves traded for Teixeira last season, he mashed down the stretch just like he did for you guys. We still didn’t make the playoffs, but I want to make clear that this isn’t what I’m referring to. Down the stretch in 2007 the Braves pitching, aside from Smoltz and Hudson, was atrocious. It was city-league softball if Smoltz and Huddy weren’t out there. Teixeira’s play in that stretch was the definition of elite.
Watching Teixeira in 2008, however, has set what I see being played out on the field against my value of statistics/production against each other to some extent.
To explain what I mean, watching Jeff Francoeur this year, I would’ve told you without looking at any stats (besides what they display on the TV) that he was awful. And the numbers back this up. The opposite would be true for players like Chipper & McCann…they looked good to the fan’s eye, and put up great numbers.
But there is something about Teixeira that makes what I watched, mostly this season, not quite match up with the numbers he had when he was traded. I just checked his slash stats from his time with Atlanta this season (.283/.390/.512) and yet again I was surprised they were that good. I can’t explain it, and to say he’s simply “very good” instead of “elite” doesn’t really explain it, but I suppose it’s a basic way to say what I want to say.
The fan’s eye vs. production confusion I experienced is entirely from this season, so maybe I just had a bad taste in my mouth after his usual mundane April & May, or from the fact that the Braves were stagnant at the best of times this season.
By the way, although some Braves fans aren’t thrilled with Kotchman’s play with us this season, I’m excited to have him. His defense is solid and I think he’ll bounce back at the plate next season.
Anyway, thanks for reading & good luck next season!
And who really believes the Angels will get in a bidding war with the Red Sox or Yankees?
After letting Casey Kotchman go, who had three years left on a contract, it is imperative the Angels sign Mark Teixeira. Letting Teixeira go know would be stupid. Sign Mark Teixeira and let Francisco Rod riguez go!!!!!
Just wanted to chim in with my opinion of being a Braves fan and watching Tex over the past couple of years. I have to partly agree wtih RandomBravesFan. However, to me I think another factor was that Tex seemed to accumulate most of his stats for us when the game was out of reach. Sure, he had some clutch hits here and there, but like mentioned, he’s a very good player, not the game changing type. From what I know in his time in Atlanta, he was always a good teammate and is a good guy, so he won’t hurt you in the clubhouse. Good luck in your pursuit of him.
Gotta say I agree with the previous Braves fan’s comments. Watching Tex play day in and day out, there’s just something missing - an intangible that a guy like Jeter has (or had, anyway).
As to the previous comments about ARod, both he & Tex are cut from the same mold in my book. Statistically both are elite players, but not necessarily guys that based on intangibles you’d look to build a team around.
Don’t get me wrong, I like Tex and hope he does well - but I think given the likely $$ and years it will take to lock him up this winter, the Braves were wise to get a guy like Kotchman in return and say farewell.
While Tex was one of the Angels most productive players in the playoffs, how may games did he help y’all win? That in a nutshell is Tex, he is a numbers guy, not someone who can put a club on his shoulders. Yeah, A-Rod is a good comparison, He’s not someone you build a club around, The only reason to sign Tex would be to keep the Yankees or the Sox from getting him, better yet let one of them have him, get Manny, yeah alot of baggage there but when he wants to play he can carry a team. Look what he did for those sorry Dodgers….
It’s kind of interesting seeing the mostly positive comments (IMO, deservedly so) about Tex from Angels fans. As a lifelong Braves fan, I remember going to the ESPN message boards after the trade and you should have seen all of the comments by ticked-off Angels fans after the trade!
To paraphrase, most of the comments were, “I can’t believe we traded Casey Kotchman. He has really turned into such a good player. We traded away a Gold Glove 1B. He’s the best defensive 1B in the league!”
I tried to assure them that they were not only getting a very good hitter, but that Mark Teixeira was also a Gold Glove 1B who would make some very nice defensive plays for the Halos.
I’m afraid most of them were still depressed. Looking back, I think that it was a good trade for both teams. As most of you folks already knew, Casey Kotchman is a fine 1B in his own right and obviously, you have seen that Tex is a highly-skilled defensive player who also swings a very productive bat.
Thanks, Random Braves Fan, for your thoughtful assessment. I have a completely different opinion based on my observation of his time with the Angels…. but granted that was over a much shorter, salary-driven (and playoff-driven) period of time. It’s a tough call….but I’m still hoping the Angels sign him.
Your observation of the numbers not equaling the product on the field was exactly how I felt about Casey Kotchman’s time with the Angels. He was a nice player, but I never saw a player who lived up to the hype that accompanies all the years atop the Baseball America prospect list. The power never really developed… and the .330 minor league average translated to a .300 (at best) big league average. And fragile….to my recollection the only professional athlete to miss an entire season to mono!?
I wish Kotchman the best, but he was worth 2 months of Teixeira (and/or the 2 compensation picks he’ll bring if he signs elsewhere).
I’m going to have to agree with Random Braves Fan.
Teixeira is a very good player just sort-of piles up stats at the beginning of the year. I saw him take way too many called third strikes this year. While he’s phenomenal after the all-star break, he’s basically dead weight at the beginning of the season.
Like Random Braves Fan said, you look at his numbers and are really surprised they’re as good as they are.
That said, his defense is second to none.